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Post by colebridgebull on Mar 12, 2019 21:02:08 GMT
The referendum was advisory.
The first mistake was calling it. The second mistake was acting on it without considering the very obvious consequences.
It’s always been screamingly obvious that the whole thing was a massive clusterfeck and completely undeliverable.
Part of democratic society is the ability to change your mind once the facts are known. To do otherwise is as far from democracy as it is possible to be.
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Post by singe on Mar 12, 2019 21:04:24 GMT
“Or their elected representatives” HTH
In this case, the EU referendum was an example of 'the people' excercising their own power. MPs had a vote, as did every other eligible member of the state. Parliament's task, as publc servants, was to enact the results of the referendum.
The power is vested in the people. The exception being when Members of Parlaiment decide that they know better.
I think we all know better now we are two and a half tears dow noter road. The vote was only advisory and it was corrupt. The initial referendum should now be consigned to the garbage tip. By the way, where's jammo these days under his new guise? Edit; cb sort of beat me to the first point. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 12, 2019 21:13:19 GMT
Just to clarify; as a paid up member of the ignorant masses, I have no idea what is the ideal outcome is. However, given the amount of pledges MPs of all colour have made about honouring the referendum (particularly those of a blue persuasion), it would be nice to think that the whole cabal would be found to be in breach of contract and sacked.
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Post by singe on Mar 12, 2019 21:16:59 GMT
Just to clarify; as a paid up member of the ignorant masses, I have no idea what is the ideal outcome is. However, given the amount of pledges MPs of all colour have made about honouring the referendum (particularly those of a blue persuasion), it would be nice to think that the whole cabal would be found to be in breach of contract and sacked. ....and that should include those that told many lies before the referendum itself. |
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Post by Peroni on Mar 13, 2019 9:16:48 GMT
The initial referendum should now be consigned to the garbage tip
guess we should take that attitude at every election - just allow those mostest (say the top 500 on first day of each year from the sunday times rich list) wealthy and privileged to run the country for us, by internet from their tax havens |
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Post by Palms Halt on Mar 13, 2019 9:20:27 GMT
The initial referendum should now be consigned to the garbage tip
guess we should take that attitude at every election - just allow those mostest (say the top 500 on first day of each year from the sunday times rich list) wealthy and privileged to run the country for us, by internet from their tax havens It was these people, with the threat of the EU tightening up the tax loopholes, that brainwashed you all into voting to make them richer in the first place. |
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Post by colebridgebull on Mar 13, 2019 9:26:56 GMT
The initial referendum should now be consigned to the garbage tip
guess we should take that attitude at every election - just allow those mostest (say the top 500 on first day of each year from the sunday times rich list) wealthy and privileged to run the country for us, by internet from their tax havens With respect, that's precisely how we've got into this position. Sadly all too many are prepared to be manipulated by the very wealthy pandering to their prejudices and laziness, rather than taking the trouble to actually question just what it is that they're actually after. See the recent clip of "man of the people" and "actually the others are the elite" Rees-Mogg frantically trying to avoid answering the question of how much money he has personally made from the situation he is manufacturing. Insider trading at its finest. The British public have been played. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 13, 2019 9:49:48 GMT
I wonder what the turnout at the next General Election is likely to be? 5%? 10%?
Clearly, intelligence isn't an issue when entering into a career in politics.
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Post by Palms Halt on Mar 13, 2019 10:15:35 GMT
I wonder what the turnout at the next General Election is likely to be? 5%? 10%?
Clearly, intelligence isn't an issue when entering into a career in politics.
I think it'll be as high as usual, but we'll see a very strange voting pattern, with different parties coming in to play. Will be very interesting to see how the main parties will campaign. I think UKIP will do incredibly well, so somebody credible needs to stand in direct opposition to their stance, not take the UKIP-lite approach that the Tories have over the last 4 years |
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Post by Barney still in B-Block on Mar 13, 2019 10:24:52 GMT
I wonder what the turnout at the next General Election is likely to be? 5%? 10%?
Clearly, intelligence isn't an issue when entering into a career in politics.
You might well think that. We are so poorly served currently, on both sides, that I doubt there has ever been a more useless, incompetent bunch in Westminster Which said, there is clearly just enough intelligence in a majority of them to realise that they shouldn't, in good conscience, nod through something that will make the country poorer. And not only economically. The referendum was advisory, it took place before a concept became real, hard facts, and there was proven corruption and illegality from the leave campaign, with likely much more to be demonstrated when certain individuals end up in court. A no-deal Brexit has been championed most loudly by hugely wealthy individuals terrified of becoming slightly less-wealthy if we remain in the EU, and Mrs. 'No deal is better than a bad deal' May will today vote to remove leaving with no-deal from the agend - You couldn't make this sh!t up. Parliament clearly can't sort this out, so what do we have left? This should go back to the people, and this time binding - Do we leave the EU on the terms negotiated by Mrs May, or admit that this whole fiasco was an enormous mistake. |
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Post by Palms Halt on Mar 13, 2019 10:31:46 GMT
This should go back to the people, and this time binding - Do we leave the EU on the terms negotiated by Mrs May, or admit that this whole fiasco was an enormous mistake. No, the people we've elected to make the decisions for us, from their supposedly better informed positions, should make the right choice for the country themselves. I they're incapable of doing that then they should resign from parliament and have a by-election to replace them with somebody who is capable. |
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Post by Palms Halt on Mar 13, 2019 10:33:10 GMT
This should go back to the people, and this time binding - Do we leave the EU on the terms negotiated by Mrs May, or admit that this whole fiasco was an enormous mistake. No, the people we've elected to make the decisions for us, from their supposedly better informed positions, should make the right choice for the country themselves. I they're incapable of doing that then they should resign from parliament and have a by-election to replace them with somebody who is capable. And talking of which, our very own MP seems to be too busy toeing the party line to boost his career opportunities within the Tory party to be voting in the country's greater interest |
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Post by Peroni on Mar 13, 2019 10:37:23 GMT
with respect, rather than play hard ball and tell EU where they can put their wasteful system, any deal has had to be so watered down to keep the rich elite remainers happy that they (the rich elite remainers) have put the UK into such a weak position, the EU are laughing at us even more than normal, so whatever happens, the UK will now be in a worse position than ever, with the possibility the rich elite remainers might keep their personal gravy train from the EU.
PS Barney - "Do we leave the EU on the terms negotiated by Mrs May" - what fcukin choice is that ! Its a bit like KK asking if we want a glos run relegation team in conference north or a team in southern league, no we want a proper run team much higher than that. We should be leaving with a proper deal as wanted by the majority.
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Post by Barney still in B-Block on Mar 13, 2019 10:38:42 GMT
No, the people we've elected to make the decisions for us, from their supposedly better informed positions, should make the right choice for the country themselves. I they're incapable of doing that then they should resign from parliament and have a by-election to replace them with somebody who is capable. And talking of which, our very own MP seems to be too busy towing the party line to boost his career opportunities within the Tory party to be voting in the country's greater interestNot mine fella. My MP has consistently stated that we are better of within the EU, and has vocally led his party on a platform of putting this back to the people, when they actually know the reality of what they're voting for. |
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Post by Palms Halt on Mar 13, 2019 10:45:05 GMT
And talking of which, our very own MP seems to be too busy towing the party line to boost his career opportunities within the Tory party to be voting in the country's greater interestNot mine fella. My MP has consistently stated that we are better of within the EU, and has vocally led his party on a platform of putting this back to the people, when they actually know the reality of what they're voting for. Lucky you. |
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Post by Barney still in B-Block on Mar 13, 2019 10:45:09 GMT
with respect, rather than play hard ball and tell EU where they can put their wasteful system, any deal has had to be so watered down to keep the rich elite remainers happy that they (the rich elite remainers) have put the UK into such a weak position, the EU are laughing at us even more than normal, so whatever happens, the UK will now be in a worse position than ever, with the possibility the rich elite remainers might keep their personal gravy train from the EU. PS Barney - "Do we leave the EU on the terms negotiated by Mrs May" - what fcukin choice is that ! Its a bit like KK asking if we want a glos run relegation team in conference north or a team in southern league, no we want a proper run team much higher than that. We should be leaving with a proper deal as wanted by the majority.I'm sure the majority also wouldn't mind a better salary, a nicer car, a three-day weekend, beer at three bob a pint, even a football club run by people who have a small clue what they're doing, but newsflash. We don't always get what we want. Or voted for. This will go one of three ways. We leave with best deal we can negotiate. We leave with no deal. We don't leave. |
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Post by Barney still in B-Block on Mar 13, 2019 10:46:42 GMT
Not mine fella. My MP has consistently stated that we are better of within the EU, and has vocally led his party on a platform of putting this back to the people, when they actually know the reality of what they're voting for. Lucky you. Not really. Not unless we all end up with Vince's preferred outcome. |
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Post by Palms Halt on Mar 13, 2019 10:47:16 GMT
with respect, rather than play hard ball and tell EU where they can put their wasteful system, any deal has had to be so watered down to keep the rich elite remainers happy that they (the rich elite remainers) have put the UK into such a weak position, the EU are laughing at us even more than normal, so whatever happens, the UK will now be in a worse position than ever, with the possibility the rich elite remainers might keep their personal gravy train from the EU. PS Barney - "Do we leave the EU on the terms negotiated by Mrs May" - what fcukin choice is that ! Its a bit like KK asking if we want a glos run relegation team in conference north or a team in southern league, no we want a proper run team much higher than that. We should be leaving with a proper deal as wanted by the majority.I'm sure the majority also wouldn't mind a better salary, a nicer car, a three-day weekend, beer at three bob a pint, even a football club run by people who have a small clue what they're doing, but newsflash. We don't always get what we want. Or voted for. This will go one of three ways. We leave with best deal we can negotiate. We leave with no deal. We don't leave. Haha. I'm forever baffled by people who think we should just get "a better deal". Why on earth would they give us a better deal? They don't want us, or any other countries who will be watching on and thinking of doing the same, to leave. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 13, 2019 10:59:54 GMT
This should go back to the people, and this time binding - Do we leave the EU on the terms negotiated by Mrs May, or admit that this whole fiasco was an enormous mistake. No, the people we've elected to make the decisions for us, from their supposedly better informed positions, should make the right choice for the country themselves. I they're incapable of doing that then they should resign from parliament and have a by-election to replace them with somebody who is capable. They did. 500 out of 650 MPs voted to Remain. They are better informed than the proletariate. The government advised that proletariate to Remain. They didn't. |
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Post by Palms Halt on Mar 13, 2019 11:05:35 GMT
No, the people we've elected to make the decisions for us, from their supposedly better informed positions, should make the right choice for the country themselves. I they're incapable of doing that then they should resign from parliament and have a by-election to replace them with somebody who is capable. They did. 500 out of 650 MPs voted to Remain. They are better informed than the proletariate. The government advised that proletariate to Remain. They didn't. proletariat |
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